An emerging act from Long Island, Deadlands offers a take on heavy metal that’s massively hook-driven but brutal as well. Their upcoming EP, Seven, is their first with Spinefarm Records, and delivers a modern take on metalcore that’s memorable and exciting. We reached out to vocalist Kasey Karlsen, who made a name for herself doing vocal covers, who offers both an impressive range of extreme vocals as well as a soaring clean delivery. She discussed her (and Deadlands’) rise on social media and combating the ‘TikTok band’ argument, the need for gateway bands in the scene, the songwriting dynamic between her and multi-instrumentalist CJ Arey, what she likes to do outside of the band, and how Deadlands approached their EP Seven, based on the 7 deadly sins, differently than other groups.
Dead Rhetoric: Seven is based on the seven deadly sins, which is a suitably metal topic. How do you feel you approached the subject area differently than other groups?
Kasey Karlsen: I think at first we did approach it in the way that a band normally would. Like, we were like, “oh yeah, that’s really cool!” Then I think the difference comes from the writing. When I was writing it, at least the lyrics and melodies, I was taking all of the bad parts of myself. All of the ‘sinny’ parts and putting them on paper. Ultimately, I tried to turn it into a question of how I could take these awful parts of myself and better the person that I am. That is what I really hope people do when they are listening to these songs. I hope they say, “Oh this is my favorite song! I wonder why? Is it the lyrics that I am attached to? Is it because someone did this to me, or maybe I do this to people?” Maybe we could just better ourselves as humans.
Dead Rhetoric: One thing that I did notice myself, I really liked the take that you did on ‘lust’ in “Limbo” and not having it be the “super sexy” version. It’s more portrayed in a negative light.
Karlsen: Exactly! You nailed it on the head. As a person, I’m not a hyper-sexual person, and more power to anyone who is, but for me, it’s not my brand. I couldn’t really relate to doing something super sexy and lusty, so having “Limbo” be more about the destructive and sad part of lust, like you were saying, it’s more of a different take than other bands that have done this concept.
Dead Rhetoric: Could you discuss balancing bringing listeners out of the present while giving them some food for thought? Is there a balance that you are looking at with those ideas?
Karlsen: I wouldn’t necessarily say a balance with that. I think it varies per listener. It depends on our needs, and what we are thinking about at the moment. We want to create a different world, where people can escape if they really want to. Hence why the songs aren’t so on the nose, like, “your greed is blah blah blah,” we are trying to have the listener paint their own picture and interpret it in their own way. If they need that escape for a minute from everything that is going on out here, but if they are struggling with something internally, I do really hope that this will allow them to reflect on themselves.
Dead Rhetoric: What are the biggest components you try to bring out with a Deadlands song?
Karlsen: The biggest thing, I guess to point it out, is that my favorite way to write songs is to start with the melody and the lyrics. I feel that will drive the force of the song, however, I have such a pop influence myself. So does CJ [Arey], he’s poppy as well. Ultimately, we want the songs to be catchy, and we want the songs to be good. The thing that CJ has stressed so often to me, is that if the song is good, with just the guitar and a singer, then it’s a good song. If you strip everything down to its core, and it can’t hold up with just a piano and a singer, then it’s time to go back to the drawing board and do it again.
So to have it be catchy, to have good lyrics that represent good songwriting – I feel like a lot of people don’t understand the importance of songwriting, when it comes to cliches and all that stuff. To have it be unique and stand on its own, not just in metal, but in any category of music, I think that’s really important for us.
Dead Rhetoric: You mentioned CJ, could you discuss the dynamic between the two of you when writing?
Karlsen: For the most part, CJ will take over the majority of the songs. He’ll do the guitars, the bass, the drums, the production. He is also considered a producer, and he has been producing a few bands on his own, in his own little business that he started, which is cool. Then I do most of the lyric and melody writing. I think we have the two worlds separate, and then we have to mesh it. Not everything always sticks, so we need to change things, so we can’t be too picky about parts that we might like.
There has to be compromise, and what I always say when we are writing is that if one of us doesn’t like it, and the other one doesn’t like the other idea, then we have to make sure that we do something new that we both have no attachment to. We just try it. Even so, it might wind up that one thing sticks, if it’s one of us or the other, it doesn’t matter. You have to do what is best for the song.
Dead Rhetoric: You have used social media before Deadlands even started. What are some of the challenges you have faced, either in Deadlands or personally, in trying to maintain and expand followers?
Karlsen: I think the biggest one is that most people who follow me do know that I am in Deadlands, but I think that they don’t understand that Deadlands is not just a TikTok band. I think that has been the hardest part about it. To define ourselves amongst the TikTok bands. But I also think, just the stigma behind the word ‘Tiktok band,’ is crazy. Even though you have the word band – we don’t exist solely on TikTok. One amazing band that always gets called a TikTok band, is Halocene. I will never understand why people call them a TikTok band because they do so much outside, and they are so successful and so good.
But also, you could say that The Pretty Wild is a TikTok band. Look, they literally just played Rockville as their first show ever! That’s so crazy! To think that we fall into the category of gimmicky stuff, I don’t know. I don’t even know what constitutes being a TikTok band, but we are a real band and we want to be known as such!
Dead Rhetoric: I can understand where you are coming from with that. Being in my 40s, I see a lot of people my age and older, there’s this stigma of ‘this isn’t real, it’s TikTok,’ so I think it’s a matter of adapting to the times.
Karlsen: 100%, I think you are absolutely right. Metal elitists are so prevalent now more than ever. Now they have access to keyboards and comments and screens, so it’s so much worse!
Dead Rhetoric: That’s funny, and I agree. It seems like lately when I’ve talked with groups about that, they have said it’s better and I’m like, “where are you looking?”
Karlsen: There’s pros and cons with everything, and sometimes I don’t think people need to spread their opinions online [laughs].
Dead Rhetoric: In regards to that, I have seen some of your Deadlands posts online, and that you do reply to some of them. How do you deal with the negative and almost bigoted reactions to what you are doing?
Karlsen: Sometimes I resort to the ultimate in public humiliation [laughs] and I’ll post it on my story. Honestly, I don’t know if it’s my first death threat, but it’s the first one that I really saw. I was just posting a video with my friends Rex and Luisa, because we just like to hang out and have fun. We all like to sing and scream and whatever. Someone commented, I was standing in the middle of them and they wrote, “I would love to blow the brains out of that freak in the middle.” So I posted it on my story, and was like, “This guy has a daughter. You put up pictures of yourself with your daughter. Imagine if someone said that to your daughter?” And everyone was like, “What the actual fuck?” Who says that? You have to be clinically insane. That’s pretty much all you can do.
I’m not going to internalize that. Like, am I some sort of freak? I am a freak! I don’t care! Like, who gives a shit? Thank you for pointing out the obvious and just admitting that you are insane. I couldn’t care less. I think I can attribute that to the band Attila, that I used to listen to all the time when I was getting into metal. Their whole mentality was ‘give no fucks.’ Who cares what anyone says about you? I still preach that to this day. I have no choice. If I was upset over every hate comment I got, I would be crying all day, every day. Granted, there are some days where I’m like, “ugh, these people are commenting on my body” or “the toxic Sleep Token fandom is saying I can’t cover Vessel because I’m not Vessel.” But you can’t care. You take it with a grain of salt and keep pushing.
In my brain, I’m thinking, one day [that person] is going to become a fan. I’m telling you that right now. I bet they will be watching a show at a festival 10-15 years from now and you will be salty because you commented that on my Instagram 20 years ago [laughs].
Dead Rhetoric: How do you draw the line on your personal life when you are so exposed on social media?
Karlsen: Honestly, with my audience, I want to be transparent in everything I do. I wouldn’t post something that I’m absolutely not there for. To me, it doesn’t feel like too much of a task. I’m just being myself. There’s nothing to hide for me, except maybe my address [laughs]. I don’t find it to be harmful or whatever. Of course, there are a few people that tend to push the boundary, but I don’t take it personally. I signed up for this.
Somebody that kind of upsets me, along those lines, is Chappell Roan. I get the privacy thing. I get that you are a human and you need your alone time, of course. I can’t imagine being in the spotlight that much, all the time, and being so recognizable down the street. But you did sign up to be an artist, and you know how music touches people. She continually has been like, ‘don’t touch me, hug me, come up to me,’ and I don’t know, I find that to be kind of silly.
Dead Rhetoric: What are your thoughts on being a gateway band for people to get into metal? Are you good with that sort of term?
Karlsen: 100%, I think that’s a great term. I think we need more gateway bands. Why on earth would we not want the artists and people in our genre to succeed? Everyone is getting mad at Sleep Token for blowing up and getting the recognition that they deserve. On the flip side, I do understand the ticket sales and how expensive tickets are becoming for them, and how the real fans aren’t able to get tickets, but that’s great for Sleep Token. It’s not their fault. Maybe the venues could do something, maybe Sleep Token could do something about it but I don’t know that much.
I guess I’m just happy for the success that metal and rock are getting. When the genre is doing good, we are all doing good. You have more potential friends and artists and more people to connect with.
Dead Rhetoric: Could you go into how you experiment with different scream techniques?
Karlsen: One of my favorite things to do, or at least was, when I was more concerned about expanding my range, was doing a whisper scream. I will pretty much just make a whisper – I won’t make much noise, but just go “ahh” or “ohh” and what it does is to get you the proper mouth shape for the sound that you want. Essentially, what you are doing is screaming is creating resonance in your mouth to make the noises you are hearing.
One of my favorite screams that I do, which I would like to call it a signature but I don’t know, is called a tunnel scream. I have to make a really weird face to do it, like I have to fold my tongue over. I have this air pocket that creates this really gremlin-y, gargly sound. The way I discovered that was just whispering and messing around with my tongue [laughs]. That’s how I get most of the sounds that I make.
Dead Rhetoric: So do you feel like you are still in the area where you are discovering more range?
Karlsen: Yes and no. I think as far as technique goes, there are two main types. I’m in the false chord category, and I think I have exceeded all my options in false chord. I think I need to unlock fry screaming now in order to get the extra hundreds of screams arsenal. With fry, you can do an insane amount of screams. I believe Will Ramos does fry. I have a lot to learn [still].
Dead Rhetoric: You have done a number of collaborations already, what are some realistic and dream collabs you’d like to do?
Karlsen: A dream collaboration, Courtney LaPlante, Chris Motionless, Corey Taylor, those are the easy top three. I think a little more reachable, I would love to have Rory Rodriguez from Dayseeker on a song. Rory is fabulous. He is absolutely awesome and I think his vocals are incredible. I don’t know if it’s possible or tangible, but I think Lorna Shore is so sick, and I would love Will Ramos on a song. I guess another intangible one that I would literally die if she said she would be on a Deadlands song, would be Billie Eilish. She was at Knocked Loose’s set, so you never know!
Dead Rhetoric: What are your current goals for Deadlands. If you look a few years down the road, where do you want to be?
Karlsen: One of the goals, which I feel like we have this every year, but to get on some festivals. Thats the biggest thing. This year, we aren’t on festivals, but we have so much going on that I don’t care. We have just been working on ourselves and we have been fine. But festivals are a big thing. Support tours have been a big thing lately. We have been headlining and doing those gigs here and there, but to touch back on what we were talking about before in bridging the gap between a ‘real band’ and a ‘TikTok band,’ you do that by showing up in front of people. I think that has been our priority and it’s going to be our priority for the next few years for sure.
Dead Rhetoric: Everyone always wants you to be the headlining band, and they don’t realize that you are playing to your audience. When you go out as support, it allows you to grow the audience. With your sound, and growing an audience, who should bring you out with them?
Karlsen: I gotta say, the boys in Motionless in White, they are my favorite band of all time so I’m always going to manifest that. Someone who I feel like you might not necessarily picture on a bill but it makes sense in context, I would say The Word Alive, but I think that makes sense. I love The Word Alive, I just recently met them all and went on stage with them and it was awesome. They were such cool dudes through and through, and the experience was so much fun. I love them, they are great! I love the band Rivals, and I’d love to tour with them. Not Enough Space is also really good, but I also feel like Not Enough Space almost makes too much sense.
I would love a wild card like Set it Off. They are a really good answer because they are so theatrical, and they do have some heavy stuff, but I feel like their audience would really like us. We have some theatrical elements, and I feel like if we threw in a bit more they would really enjoy us. I think Set it Off fans are so cool. Anytime I have been to a Set it Off show and talked with their fans, they have been so nice. I feel like they would love the clean portions of our songs at the very least.
Dead Rhetoric: It’s funny that you mention Set it Off. I was just talking to TSS a few weeks ago and they had mentioned that touring with Set it Off recently had really helped them out.
Karlsen: I think Set it Off is such a cool band. I don’t even want to say that they are underrated because they do have such a big audience, but I feel like they deserve more for sure.
Dead Rhetoric: We have spoken a little about this already, but if you could shift the music scene in one direction, what would you like to see more of?
Karlsen: I would like to see more, I don’t know if tolerance is the right word, but more inclusivity. We pride ourselves on being so inclusive, like the outcasts come here. I feel like the elitists have turned it into, “if you listen to Sleep Token, then you are a poseur because they aren’t really metal” or that “nu metal isn’t really a genre.” Bruh, it has metal at the end of it. I don’t know what they are talking about. It’s all these catch 22s that literally don’t make sense. It’s so funny to me, when people will call me a poseur, my entire room is decorated in fan paraphernalia. I’ve been in this scene since I was 13-14 years old. I have no patience for it anymore. If you are going to say that metal is inclusive, then prove it and actually show it. Stop being a fake, I’m so over it.
Dead Rhetoric: That’s a great point. When I was younger, I was more in that category of needing to make those distinctions, but as I’ve gotten older I just can’t do 300bpm death metal all day every day.
Karlsen: Exactly, and what is the harm in that? What is the harm in variety? It just means you have an eclectic taste in music. That makes you more commendable than sticking to the same genre and that’s it.
Dead Rhetoric: I saw you are a big fan of gaming. What are some that have piqued your interest?
Karlsen: I am a Fortnite addict. I used to play a lot of other games, but that one takes up 99.99% of my attention when I am gaming. However, I am actually in a video game. I voice act in a game, and it’s called Kristala. It’s so much fun. They call it a Dark Souls RPG, and that it’s almost like Assassin’s Creed. I think that’s right on the money. It’s a story game. If you are a cat person, there are cats involved. You are a cat [laughs], so I love that aspect of it. Kristala is so much fun, I love it.
I would say a game that I used to play that I want to bring back is Dead By Daylight. I’m a huge horror buff. I love horror. The coffins, I have horror posters, I have little Jason and Frankenstein right here, but Dead By Daylight is so much fun. It’s essentially freeze tag with horror movie killers. It’s great.
Dead Rhetoric: Any other big interests you have outside of music and gaming?
Karlsen: I actually love the beach. I have been really into fitness lately. I’m psychotic [laughs] but I have been wanting to improve my health a bit more. For tour, for my career. One big thing I did was quit vaping. I had been vaping since I was 15, and while it doesn’t sound like a long time because I’m 22, it’s seven years. It’s been a long time. The fact that I quit that is really nice and I feel like my lungs are healing themselves every day. I have been going to the gym a lot lately, and falling in love with the process of trying to get my body to where I want it to be. Not that it matters what you look like, but I have been eating cleaner and better and just trying to treat my body a bit nicer.
Dead Rhetoric: You are on tour this summer, what else do you have planned for the rest of this year?
Karlsen: We are just going to be writing and touring. That’s essentially it. We already started on the next album. We have a song that’s already finished, which is crazy. It’s been funny because we are already planning to add more to Seven, maybe later this year. But we are just writing and touring, that’s our priority.